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 I have been banned.

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PostSubject: I have been banned.   Sat Sep 25, 2010 3:29 pm

Well, I suppose it's time to tell everyone what's actually going on. About 4 days ago, I was playing in a match, after all of you had seemingly gone to bed. I seemed to crash out of the game, and haven't had the server on my list since (I've had a chance to tell lee and qbit about this already, and neither of them had ever heard of such a thing). Honestly? I thought the server crashed for about 2 days, until Mario was kind enough to tell me it was still up (and yes, I did try manually connecting to both the public and the private server, and the private server was after it was brought up again, under the new port).

So, Having finally caught El_bart0 online, he told me that what I'm experiencing is a ban! Two things of note about this ban. First, Radio had just changed the password (again), so nobody who was online that night could have done it from in game (we actually had a problem where none of us could ban Mr.Gay and radio seemed to be AFK on IRC). Second, nobody from the clan (or with admin access) was in the game at the time. This means I was banned through rconn (which also explains why I didn't get a notice that I was banned), and to my knowledge, only two people in the clan have access to that. Since qbit seemed to have no idea what was happening, I can only assume it was Radio who banned me.

So, specifically, I was declared not a member of exile, despite everyone else in exile seemingly having no problems with my current irregularity, and was then stealth banned without anyone in the clan knowing about it (and I had not broken any rules of the server to warrant such an act). Really, I find this to be rather funny, if for no other reason than because Radio really didn't have to go to these lengths. If you don't want me playing on your server, that's fine, and well within your rights as the admin! I have happily left another server and never returned due to the admin and myself not getting along (despite being a generally well liked member of the server at large).

So, with that now out in the open, no I did not vanish into thin air, and no, I'm not experiencing some bug in the game. I am, it seems, not welcome on the server, and so I shall happily leave, keeping the friendships I made, and likely encountering all of you at some point or another, either on DTG, or perhaps even ESK. Given that I don't have access to the server, It seems illogical for me to continue wearing the clan tag, as it's difficult to be a member of a server that you can't play on. Despite everything, I leave on good terms, I'm not even mad about how my ban ended up coming about. Still, you might just want to tell people you don't want them on your server in future, it could end up saving you and them a lot of time. =P

So, see you all in game! =D

-Felirc-
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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Sat Sep 25, 2010 3:44 pm

Didn't read your novel but I told you that you are out and you should check our forums. You just ignored me and went on as if nothing has happened. Not the first time something like this has happened and I don't really want to argue with you because I don't know you, don't know why you are in the clan or whatsoever.

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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:11 pm

Well, I did read the novel.

Just out of curiosity, what was the story leading up to this?

Stealth banning does not seem to me as a reasonable course of action unless someone has repeatedly and seriously pissed off the clan.
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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Sun Sep 26, 2010 6:50 pm

Quote :
Just out of curiosity, what was the story leading up to this?
He got kicked from clan, didn't accept it, got banned.

Regarding the kick:
Quote :
I was declared not a member of exile, despite everyone else in exile seemingly having no problems with my current irregularity
Thats a false assumption. Feonica let you join this clan to replace her as a player after her leaving. Beside of that alone being a stupid reason for someone to join, you failed doing so. Further I didn't have the feeling that you really supported the clan. Sure you wore the clan tag but thats it. I've rarely seen you on our server, almost never at our forums. For me the question is not why someone shouldn't be part of the clan but why he should. In your case I failed to find any reasons why you should stay. And honestly talking to you is like talking to fuf, you either ignore me or answer with a big bunch of ill-conceived and/or unrelated stuff. The only players aside of you who got a permanent ban (via iptables not via rcon btw...) on my server are nadz and fuf. With everyone else I usually can figure out a different solution.


I hope this is clear now.

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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Mon Sep 27, 2010 12:16 am

Quote :
Well, I did read the novel.

Just out of curiosity, what was the story leading up to this?

Happily, although this may end up being another one of those books, I tend to be rather detail oriented in general. =P

Edit:Yep, longer than the last one. =P

Well, as for the events leading up to my ban, I haven't been very active on exile lately. My current schedule keeps me on late nights (or very early in the morning for most of you), and so I'd only end up seeing people on exile maybe one night a week, and I'd end up playing there about that often. Ironically, Fish, you're the person I encountered most from the server during that time. =P

About 3 days before the ban, I actually had some free time during the day, and I popped on the server, said hi to everyone, and generally had fun. They told me that Qbit was fighting Heddiz the next day, and I managed to shift my schedule so I could be on for it (in fact, about an hour and a half early). I also had to ban someone a few nights before that, and I noticed that my password wasn't up to date. When I mentioned that my macro was outdated, Qbit whispered me the new password, and I updated my macro. The next day, I showed up, chatted with a bunch of people I hadn't seen in a while, played a couple matches and watched Qbit's fight (even recorded the matches).

Now, since this happened a while ago, and admittedly, days tend to blend together for me a bit lately (staying up through the night can do that =P), it was either the next day, or the day after that, that the ban occurred. I logged onto the server, fairly late for most people, but qbit, lee, punisher, radio, and graz were on (I think Yasha and ST too, but if they were, they didn't stay on more than 5 minutes after I joined). Again, I joked around, played a match or two, and eventually, everyone was saying they had to head to sleep, and they logged off. In the end, Myself, Punisher, and lee were all that remained, although radio was sitting in IRC, I believe talking to punisher about something (and I could swear I jumped in every now and then on the conversation, but it wasn't really anything I remember talking about).

I was chatting with lee (we were using tells so we wouldn't disturb the people playing, or radio and punisher's conversation), and radio then asked me a question. He said, "So, have you been to the forums lately?" I told him it had been about a week, but I heard he was quitting nexuiz and didn't want to/couldn't afford to pay for the server anymore. I then also said that I saw in the thread that qbit and ST were planning on paying to keep the server running. He said, "Your information is a bit outdated, I'm not leaving, you are." I replied, "I quit? =P" and decided I'd check out the forum to see what's going on. I popped my game into windowed mode and loaded up these very forums.

I looked through his post about leaving, and the only thing he added is how he "kinda came back", and that he changed the password (which I already knew). Then I noticed that there was a posting under the news section about the active members of exile, and that I wasn't on it. I went back in game, and continued chatting with lee, who told me that he was surprised my name wasn't on that list, and was waiting for something on the forum about why it wasn't. I told him that it's a true statement, I haven't been very active, and I couldn't really deny it (nor would I try). But that it didn't matter anyway, because to my knowledge exile doesn't have a leader, and unless the group asked me to leave, I was still a member. I decided I'd talk to the group the next day, after everyone was actually on again (since all but three people had gone to bed).

After that, Mr.Gay came on as Jennahaze and started trolling, after about a minute of that, I decided to kickban, and found out that the password I just got 3 days before that didn't work. I asked lee to kickban him, since I didn't have the latest password, and he said radio just changed it and nobody had it yet. I tried asking punisher (since they were having a conversation just a few minutes before that, and I figured he might have told him) and he said he wasn't given it either. After a few minutes of asking if Radio was still on IRC and no response, we pretty much just put up with Mr.Gay because nobody had the power to stop him. About 20 minutes later, Mr.Gay finally got bored and went away, and Punisher and lee had to take off to sleep. I stuck around, mostly because I had nothing better to do, and I enjoy jumping in against stacked teams to help out. Once the score became unbalanced, I joined a team to even it out, maybe a minute later my game "crashed" (that would be the ban).

So, "He got kicked from clan, didn't accept it, got banned." isn't really accurate, because to my knowledge, you're not supposed to even be able to decide if I was kicked from the clan. You do, however, have full right to kick me from the server, although why you didn't bring it up the day before (when qbit was having his matches, as we were both there), or why you didn't just ask me to stop coming to your server, I don't know.


Quote :
Thats a false assumption. Feonica let you join this clan to replace her as a player after her leaving. Beside of that alone being a stupid reason for someone to join, you failed doing so.

Incorrect. Feonica asked me repeatedly to join the clan her in place, I actually said no about 30 times in that conversation (neol was there, he can confirm that =P). See, I had no desire to be in a clan (hence being in ToT, and rather thoroughly spelled out in my "app"), but I have a hard time saying no to people I consider friends. Feo and I tended to spend a lot of time in chat joking around, rather than actually playing the game, and after about an hour to two hours of her explaining why she's leaving and how bad she'd feel leaving the clan down one member (which, radio wasn't active at the time, and I think they only had 4-5 active members), so she asked me to join to take her place in clan wars. When I finally agreed, she ended up not quitting, and I have said many times that I was tricked into joining exile. =P While I would have taken her place, in the several months that I was highly active on the server, none took place. So, as I've said many times, the only thing me joining exile has done, is made it so people like mr.gay get banned when I'm the only one on, and occasionally do things like raising the cap limit so someone can do speed runs late at night (I also made several recommendations about maps for the server to Feo, but she ended up quitting before they were implemented).


Quote :
Sure you wore the clan tag but thats it. I've rarely seen you on our server, almost never at our forums. For me the question is not why someone shouldn't be part of the clan but why he should. In your case I failed to find any reasons why you should stay.

I actually, don't disagree with these statements at all! =P Believe it or not, I have said every single thing you wrote there about myself on several different occasions, and to the members of exile! Still, they seem to like having me around, kind of like a spectating mascot (。◕‿‿◕。). Fact of the matter is, I am a terrible member of the clan, mostly there to direct people to our forums when they ask how to apply, and occasionally ban people who deserve it. I've offered my opinion when asked, and said many times I have no interest in these forums (I wouldn't be using them now, but given my ban, it's a little hard to have this conversation in game). =P

Quote :
And honestly talking to you is like talking to fuf, you either ignore me or answer with a big bunch of ill-conceived and/or unrelated stuff.

I'll take that as a compliment. =P

In the end, I wasn't banned for not accepting that I wasn't in the clan. In truth, nothing on the forums said that I wasn't, only that I was a non-active member, which was a very accurate description! You never asked me to remove my clan tag, and you never discussed me not being in the clan, or banning me from the server, with the clan. It's okay that you don't like me, and it's a fine reason for kicking me from your server! I fully accept it, and will happily move on. If at some point you stop running this server (and either qbit or ST take over as they were saying), then I shall happily return and chat with my friends (when we are actually on the same schedule =P), until that time, this is your backyard, and that's a good enough reason for you asking me not to play in it.

Well, I think that covers everything. See you in game! =D

Edit: Had to fix my quotes, they don't seem to have the same options as most of the servers I'm used to. Oh well. =P

-Muti-test-
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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Mon Sep 27, 2010 6:36 am

Really, radio?
This is how you treat people on your server? You try them in absentia, being judge, jury and executioner, then charge them with jailbreaking before they have even heard the verdict?

Quote :
For me the question is not why someone shouldn't be part of the clan but why he should.
Before the person has joined, yes. Even if you throw someone out just because you don't like them, you at least tell it to their face before you do.

I never kicked or banned anyone from the ToT server without giving them a warning and communicating the reason to them before I did.
This is simpy no way to administrate a server. We're not even talking about obnoxious kids like Fuf or random teamkilling noobs here. I would understand if you banned them at first sight. But this is one of your clan members.

I don't think I will feel comfortable on the Exile servers anymore. I hope to see you on DTG/LOC/ESK..., Multi.
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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:34 am

Quote :
In the end, I wasn't banned for not accepting that I wasn't in the clan. In truth, nothing on the forums said that I wasn't, only that I was a non-active member, which was a very accurate description!
"Removed from eXiLe status" is accurate.

Quote :
If at some point you stop running this server (and either qbit or ST take over as they were saying), then I shall happily return and chat with my friends
Won't happen.

Quote :
You never asked me to remove my clan tag, and you never discussed me not being in the clan, or banning me from the server, with the clan.
Because you are insignificant. As you stated yourself you didn't care about the clan so why should I care about you. Clan members can discuss your leaving at the forums. If they don't care about these things (read: don't check forums regularly), its their own choice.

Quote :
So, "He got kicked from clan, didn't accept it, got banned." isn't really accurate, because to my knowledge, you're not supposed to even be able to decide if I was kicked from the clan.
You are a funny person. Instead of writing a lot of crap try using your brain and think about whose clan this is. Of course you don't know as you cared shit about this clan..

@Fish
Lets see. You don't run your server anymore. Your clan died because in the end nearly everyone didn't care anymore and went inactive. I don't think you are in a position to tell me how to handle things here.

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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Mon Sep 27, 2010 12:01 pm

Radio, I am in no position to tell you how to handle anything. You are a funny person. You strut and fret your hour upon the stage that is your server and your clan, consumed by the power you have over it.
I don't run the server anymore because I didn't want to pay for it, sound familiar?
Tot is dead because in the end no-one cared anymore and went inactive. That's an accurate observation. And therefore, you don't have to show the most basic respect for people on your server? Interesting logic.
But you are right. You don't have to do anything. It's your place, so you get to act like the kind of person that you want to be seen as.
And I get to watch from the fence and chuckle.
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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:29 pm

Quote :
I don't think I will feel comfortable on the Exile servers anymore. I hope to see you on DTG/LOC/ESK..., Multi.

<3 I'll be around. =P

Quote :
Won't happen.

That's why I said "if", it leaves it open to that never happening. =P

Quote :
Clan members can discuss your leaving at the forums. If they don't care about these things (read: don't check forums regularly), its their own choice.

You know, I was gonna put up a snarky comment about how you never actually put it on the forum for the clan to ignore, but I find myself really not caring. I do the whole snarky comment thing well, but I just don't do this whole "clan drama" thing, it bores me too quickly. So really, I'll just drop the argument.

Quote :
You are a funny person. Instead of writing a lot of crap try using your brain and think about whose clan this is. Of course you don't know as you cared shit about this clan..

Actually, that seems to have been a miscommunication between me and... everyone. =P See, I was told that exile has no leader, and therefore, every decision would be made as a group, not by a single individual. In fact, didn't you jump all over Feo for that (which, I believe is what caused her to leave)? Darn it, there's that snarky comment again, force of habit. =P Ah well, really kind of moot at this point, because, as I said, it doesn't matter if you had the power to kick me from the clan (at least, to me, it might matter quite a bit to the remaining members), you chose to kick me from the server, which you indisputably have the power to do. =P

Quote :
Tot is dead because in the end no-one cared anymore and went inactive.

I was keeping it alive for a while! ^.^

-Multi-test-
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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:42 pm

My stage certainly is not my server or my clan - what a horrible misunderstanding of a Shakespeare quotation. Aside of that, equating one single case with everyone ("people on your server") is just polemics, not a contribution to a constructive discussion. The fact is, no-one gets a ban on my server without reason, and certainly not a permanent one. The fact is, multi-tests statement that no-one told him to remove his clan tag is plain wrong. Before it was announced on the forums front page there had been a thread at the members forum discussing that. Ultimately, I told him ingame that he is no longer a member of the exile clan. At this point he wrongly wore the clan tag, which is for everyone, not limited to exile fakers, a reason to get banned.

Its hilarious that he shows up at the forums complaining about his ban happening so unexpected. If he had shown respect (yes respect is not an one-way road) and actually talked to me instead of simply ignoring me, it would never have gotten that far.

By the way, I couldn't care less about peoples opinion about me. No need to act like the kind of person that I want to be seen as. As an intelligent person you should know that things aren't always as simple as that.

Quote :
You know, I was gonna put up a snarky comment about how you never actually put it on the forum for the clan to ignore, but I find myself really not caring.
It had been on members forum (yes you had access there too) before. Honestly, I don't want to talk to you anymore. Whether you have fun trolling or just miss brain, its not worth my time.

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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Tue Sep 28, 2010 1:59 pm

Quote :
Honestly, I don't want to talk to you anymore. Whether you have fun trolling or just miss brain, its not worth my time.

Good, I want to start with this quote first, because I wish to make this very specific. The purpose of this thread is not to argue, criticize, villainize, or anything remotely intended to be hostile. Honestly, when I found out from eL_Bart0 that I was actually banned, I literally laughed out loud. Ever since our first interaction I wondered if you would ban me or if I would leave the server in protest first, and now I have my answer. =P

No, the purpose of this thread is merely to tell the many people that I have been gaming with for many months why they will no longer have me gaming with them (as well as where they can find me in game, should they choose to do so). As this is likely to cause a great deal of confusion, and when I'm encountered in game I'll be asked anyway, I am explaining everything that happened up to that point to the best of my knowledge.

Quote :
The fact is, multi-tests statement that no-one told him to remove his clan tag is plain wrong. Before it was announced on the forums front page there had been a thread at the members forum discussing that.

Actually, when I was directed to the forums, no such post appeared in my list (which means you must have removed my access before directing me to the forums), so the only post I encountered that could even remotely be associated with myself was that I was not a listed "active" member, a very accurate statement, that, to this day, I don't disagree with. =P

Quote :
Ultimately, I told him ingame that he is no longer a member of the exile clan.

Actually, you told me you weren't leaving, and that I was (implying that I should check the forum). As I did check the forum, found nothing related to my leaving, I had no reason to immediately remove my clan tag. At no point was I ever asked to have my clan tag removed, not once. In fact, in the 3 days that I was on the server, not one member of exile mentioned it, including you. The word "tag" didn't actually come up in a single conversation I saw during that entire time. =P

But the point is moot. Anyone who has interacted with me for any period of time, would know that I would have been more than willing to leave exile, if I thought for a second that the group of people I played with didn't want me in the clan anymore (no hard feelings about the matter either, considering I didn't want to join exile in the first place =P). The fact remains that I have never been asked to remove my clan tag by any member of this game (including every member of exile) at any point over the entire time that I have played, up to and including after my ban (where I encountered several exile members on DTG while still wearing my clan tag, which is against DTG rules if I was no longer in the clan). If you want to say otherwise, then you are free to do so, I don't need, nor do I possess evidence to present on the matter. =P

Quote :
If he had shown respect (yes respect is not an one-way road) and actually talked to me instead of simply ignoring me, it would never have gotten that far..

That's true, I've never shown you any respect. =P

See, when it comes to me, people can't be given respect, they have to earn it, and really, less than a handful of people that I have encountered have ever managed that feat. A good example of this would be Fish, a man I've known longer than most exile members, and someone I consider a friend. We have a lot of fun, share many similar interests, and we enjoy hanging out with each other, but it wasn't until this thread that he earned my respect.

My thread was written stating that I'm leaving on good terms, that I was not really surprised to see this ban coming, and at no point have I asked for any support in the matter. Yet still, Fish comes along, and despite the obvious personal risks (not being allowed to play on the server he frequents the most, losing communication with friends, and possibly even having friends disagree with his decision, and even potentially deriding him behind his back for such behavior, much like many people did when Feo left [which I still don't understand why these people weren't willing to say such things to her beforehand]), he decided to stand up for something he believed was right. He saw something and said that he couldn't accept it, and took a risk that almost nobody is willing to take.

The funny thing about respect like that, is that even if I was a third party in this, even if I completely disagreed with Fish, and even wanted to see multi-test banned, I would still respect Fish. See, I've done what he just did before, and I know exactly what it's like, I also know how few people are willing to do it. So yes, I've never shown you any respect, just like I've never shown anyone else respect, until they earned it. Fortunately for me, I've never asked for respect in return, but that's because I really don't care one way or the other. =P

Interestingly enough, had I not been the one banned in all of this, I would be right there beside Fish, saying my farewells, and moving on to greener pastures. =P

Alright, as that should (finally =P) clear everything up, I do believe it's time I take my leave. You all know where to find me in game! =D

-Multi-test-
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PostSubject: Re: I have been banned.   Tue Sep 28, 2010 2:51 pm

Quote :
So yes, I've never shown you any respect, just like I've never shown anyone else respect, until they earned it.
Pitty that Feo let you join exile. I wouldn't let anyone in who isn't willing to show respect to his clan members. If you think I'm alone with my opinion, you are wrong. The other members either support me or don't care enough to stick up for you.

Lets summarize; you are an average ctf player (if at all..), rather inactive, who thinks hes way more important than he really is. You don't deserve to wear our clan tag. That's all I got to say.

Oh and, don't you have better things to do than writing those huge posts here? Get a life.

- Closed -

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